when should I use the 30 amp charge vs the 20 amp

[baltictim]

My boat has 4x 100W plus 1x 160W panels (all 12v) I have 4 pcs Lifeline AGM batteries for my house bank (plus 1 AGM start battery separate). The guy who installed my system did not connect the 'Load' to the 'PV'....means I have only 20A charging. Should I connect these 2 as per the spec sheet advice for 30 A charge?
In full sun I only see up to 10 Amps of charge....I have a refrigerator compressor running plus a small cooler type chest set up as a freezer... I am in Newport, Ca... the weather is hot, the sun is out...my fridge and freezer run a lot and my batteries show -90Ah after a night and won't recover much more than 20Ah after a day in the sun...?
Running the engine also doesn't seem to allow the 100 Amp alternator to contribute as it should in daylight....does my smart regulator get confused by the solar regulator...(Brat)?
I know just enough about all this to be worried.....

[Westbranch]

Please tell us more about each of the components, we need the details( make, model, etc) of it all to understand what your problem might be..including a description of the wiring.... and I can think of more than 3 it could be but I might be all wet  or in the dark...

tks

[CDN-VT]

In my thinking & owning a hole in the water also . Engine running looks after start battery first & then there is a blead or diode battery separation that the eng alt  will NOT get a good feel of the house / cabin batterys depth of discharge .
Post the panel specs of the two different type any like WB asked any more info .
This boat of yours / Water hole have a mast ?   Shading ?


VT

[baltictim]

Thank you for the prompt response... Westbranch asked for more details..... I called the place that sold me all the components....Wego Solar in Chemainus, BC. The young man there had little to tell me except that he referred me to Midnite and to call Roy Butler....I called and left a voicemail. He also said that the Brat is rated for a maximum open circuit voltage of 60v  and that each of my four 100W panels has an open circuit voltage of 22v which puts the total incoming circuit voltage far in excess of the Brat's capabilities.

I have 4x 100W plus 1x 160W panels..all 12V. $pcs Lifeline AGM batteries (100Ah each). My sailboat has a Balmar 100Amp alternator controlled by a Balmar ARS-5 Voltage regulator. I have the regulator set at 'b-5' on the belt load manager...a field reduction of 25% as I run the alternator on a single 1/2' belt.
I have a Xantrex 2000W inverter which is used mostly to keep 2 laptop computers charged up plus a few 110v short term loads.(small appliances). I have a Xantrex 'LinkLITE' battery monitor. This monitor tells me sometimes that my batteries have a large minus Ah number and in full sun I seldom see more that 10 A of charge....
Not sure what else to say... I did not install the components....have not spoken directly with the guy who did the install. We are traveling down to Mexico on the boat...will be in San Diego for a few weeks.. Internet access is mostly OK through cell phone tethering.

thanks all...

[Westbranch]

baltictim, I assume you have all those panels wired in parallel....With out more info at this time I would suggest that you turn OFF the solar charger and since you have the LinkLite to monitor the Balmer output, see what the Balmer can output on its own,...  you are probably right about the 'Smart Charger',  a Crappy Tire model by chance?

Also I think that the Brat can only give you the output from all 5 panels at the amperage of the smallest panel  (100W) so you do not get the benefit of those extra watts from the panel, that is the downside of PWM charge controllers.  If you need those extra watts you will have to get another CC and hook the big panels to it... and from what you have told us you do need those watts!

more later after you report back... its late here in BC

[CDN-VT]

I'm assuming BIG time .
Your panels are wired all in parallel ? are they all fused separately ? , Sailboats are a HUGE pain not to see shade ,as I have one also .
That amount of panels should harvest more than 10 amps , then again how is that wired & who is measuring the harvest.
I myself would not of used a inverter to keep the DC powered units charged .
Wego Solar in Chemainus, BC , have you spoke to them ? thats alot of panels for only 10 amps .
I would of used an MPPT CC with WB-Jr

VT

[baltictim]

Thanks again guys....
I'm just getting more confused about all this...  Last night at anchor at 10:00pm my linkLite showed -38Ah and batteries at 13.2v. In the morning at 6:30am today it showed -75Ah but the voltage was 12.1 until the fridge tried to cycle at which point it showed 11.4v.....up and down as the fridge compressor tried to start. The inverter shut itself off overnight as well.
I started the engine and my alternator showed output of up to 50 amps for a short while....after 4 hours of motoring the Xantrex showed -40Ah with the batteries at 14.2v.
At noon  I am plugged in at the dock (Oceanside, Ca). I see that the panels (with no shore charger turned on) are reading 0.5A with volts at 13.4... The sun is shining. I have a radar dome above the panels which can shade portions of the 4 pcs of 100W panels. The 160W panel never is shaded...at this moment there is no shade on any of the panels.

I seem to understand that maybe the 'Brat' is not the right CC for my particular install....sorry for being so dense about this. Also when I called Wego Solar the young man there (Ben) responded as I described earlier....wtf?

[CDN-VT]

Oceanside, Ca
As in French Creek ??

IM 2 hrs away but way higher than sea datum .

VT

Plus we were in a rain gray day 2day ,Sun for an hour up here in the peaks

[Westbranch]

Quickly as I am using  a  Tablet right now on the road... ANY shade has a detrimental impact on your PV to out put more than 50% of its rated power. So just the shade from 1 stay across any panel will knacker your input to the batts...
Monitor your shade  movements while tacking, vs the panels as you go...you may be surprised!
When at anchor try for a fore and aft anchorage to keep you in the best orientation to the sun with as few shadows as possible...

Good luck
Ps get an MPPT KID or like for the most panels and use the Brat for the 160w.

[CDN-VT]

WB , He said he was in Oceanside  CA , so sailing is a we bit different , LIKE WAY .

Something is WAY off here & the WTF reply from seller is normal Island BS.

[Westbranch]

Anttena stay , all the same...Shadows... he didnt tell us what his boat is yet.... hopefully he will fill us in soon

[baltictim]

Lots of discussion...lots of learning....a long way to go.
Yesterday I spoke at length with Kyle at Midnite Solar....conclusion seems to be that the Brat is not up to the task for my system. Kyle suggested the Kid but also said I should speak with Roy in the morning to confirm. I was referred to their website to find a retailer nearby who could sell me a larger MPPT controller. I spoke with EcoDirect close by here in Carlsbad, California....They will call back today with some suggestions... Same conclusion...I never should have had a Brat in the first place. Also pointed out that having the one 160W panel in parallel with the 4 pcs 100W panels does not give me the benefit of the 160W...only 100W...is this so?....Can I use the Brat solely for the 160W panel and add a new controller for the 4 x 100's? Can I mix one MPPT controller with one PWM (Brat)? Can I do all this myself or do I need another guru?

I am tied at the dock in Oceanside, California. On our way to San Diego then Cabo san Lucas then further south in Mexico. My boat is a Baltic 42DP...the panels were installed as a bimini over the cockpit....yes, I do get shade from the backstay over the 100W panels plus I have a radar on the backstay that often shades some of the panels....The 160W panel is behind the radar and backstay and never gets any shade...well...almost never..!

Will talk with Roy soon - I hope...then back to EcoDirect to decide on whether to buy another.....then how to install it all....sigh!

Thanks again...

[Westbranch]

Are the 100 w panels in series configuration or parallel?
Series is when each panel connects to another and only 2 wires go to the charge controller.
If you are in parallel there will be 5 sets of wires going into a Combiner and then 2 wires go to the Brat.

hth

ADD.... Did Wego sell you an MNDC6 COMBINER?

[baltictim]

All of the panels are presently connected in Parallel....all go to a combiner with just two wires going to the Brat. The Brat is set up now as a 20A charger....ie the load circuit is not in use...
I had a long talk with Roy at Midnite Solar today...the outcome seems to be that I would be best served by using my existing Brat only for the 160W panel plus purchase a KID MPPT controller, connect my 4x100W panels in series and run them through the KID as a 48v array....
I can buy the KID here in California for $360 usd all in....

[CDN-VT]

Ahh Oceanside in California , Not Canada , so yur way to far away for me to stop in SIR.

As with my comment of the "( WTF reply from seller is normal Island BS. ) "

Topic of off of this Moved : http://kb1uas.com/mnsforum/index.php?topic=3427.0


VT