what type of wires to use?

[Vic]

Hi Kauai..,

Thanks for the info on the wiring of the Shunt,  to the battery negative.   That sounds fine to me,  although,  it does look like this cable does step-down to a considerably smaller cable,  which could be an issue ...  believe that this is what Larry was mentioning.

Think that you may have a Magnasine inverter ...   cannot see your Signature now,   but the inverter cables (including those going to the 3/8" bolts on the Shunt),  and battery interconnects DO need to be sized for the current rating of the Main DC breaker that feeds the Inverter.   What is the size of this breaker?

Your ferrules may be OK,  at least most of them.   I do not want my personal opinions to discourage you,  to the point of you feeling that you need to tear out much of that cable.  You have done a very nice,  neat and clean install.

If you could check the torque on each screw that has a ferrule connection,  load the system heavily (on the inverter),  in bright sun,  with the battery being charged in Bulk,  and measure the temperature of each connection with an IR thermometer,  you may find that the crimps,  ferrules,  screws and bolts show very little temperature rise.  If so,  you should be fine.

More later,   Thanks for the info,   Vic

[kauaisolarman]

Hi Kauai..,

Think that you may have a Magnasine inverter ...   cannot see your Signature now,   but the inverter cables (including those going to the 3/8" bolts on the Shunt),  and battery interconnects DO need to be sized for the current rating of the Main DC breaker that feeds the Inverter.   What is the size of this breaker?

thanks for the response.

cables from battery all the way through to inverter is 2AWG.  80A breaket will be used between the battery and the main power busbar, then 60A breaker between main bus bar and inverter.  all running 2awg wire.

this 48V system is only intended to run an air conditioner (6000btu 500watts max draw) and refridgerator (another 600w max).  inverter is a cotex 2000watt so max amps it would see is 42@48V..

the aquion batteries that this system will charge has absorb 59V and float 55V.  when batteries are reading 48V the are at 90% dod.   full charge reading is 55V.

i am also running the tristar pwm controller off the battery bank and hopefully using it as a diversion controller to heat a 48V 2000W heating element to utilize the excess power from my array.

total load off the battery bank with the inverter and dump load would be about 3800 watts maximum or about 73A assuming 52V battery state (never see more than this much load).

so
80A breaker for battery 2 awg (between battery bank and main positive bus bar)
60A breaker for inverter 2 awg (between main positive bus bar and inverter)
40A breaker for tristar PWM 8awg in/6awg to load (40A for tristar and 40A for load)
80A breaker for CC#1 with PV 3850watts 4AWG (between CC 1 and main positive bus bar)
50A breaker for CC#2 6awg (power source undetermined but 2000W max power input) (between CC 2 and main positive bus bar)

[CDN-VT]

I would move the Shunt to the LEFT mounting holes & give more room so the pos cables are NOT close !

[kauaisolarman]

will do.

decided to change all wires to UL approved stuff.

going to stick with marine fine stranded 2 awg for the battery to inverter cables.

i need help finding a good source for 2awg lugs (1/4, 5/16, 3/8) that are rated for fine stranded marine grade UL rated wire.

the lugs that i am currently using are UL rated from ANCHORbut i cant tell if they are for fine stranded cable or not.  can anyone tell me for sure how to determine if the UL approval is for the Fine stranded wire type.

the data sheet that is with the advertisement on amazon says that fine stranded wires will improve a crimped joints performance.  does that mean i can use these anchor lugs with my fine stranded tinned marine grade UL listed 2awg wire?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NI5CS4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

thanks for any input.  other than the NEC requiring lugs that are specifically designed for fine stranded wire i cannot find information on how to determine this information.  all seems to be UL486A approved?

[Vic]

Hi Kauai..,

Just looked at the Wind-Sun online store,  but could not find relatively large crimp lugs of any kind,  and could not find them on the Colorado Solar (SPS) site either.

But searching for "  fine strand crimp lugs   " should yield some results.

As an aside,  here is a Tech Note on this topic:
https://www.nema.org/Technical/Documents/Bull_105_Fine-Stranded%20Connections.pdf

Sorry to have been raining on your parade.

Will look further for appropriate lugs.   Good Luck,   Vic

[Resthome]

will do.

decided to change all wires to UL approved stuff.

going to stick with marine fine stranded 2 awg for the battery to inverter cables.

i need help finding a good source for 2awg lugs (1/4, 5/16, 3/8) that are rated for fine stranded marine grade UL rated wire.

the lugs that i am currently using are UL rated from ANCHORbut i cant tell if they are for fine stranded cable or not.  can anyone tell me for sure how to determine if the UL approval is for the Fine stranded wire type.

the data sheet that is with the advertisement on amazon says that fine stranded wires will improve a crimped joints performance.  does that mean i can use these anchor lugs with my fine stranded tinned marine grade UL listed 2awg wire?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NI5CS4/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

thanks for any input.  other than the NEC requiring lugs that are specifically designed for fine stranded wire i cannot find information on how to determine this information.  all seems to be UL486A approved?

Ultra flexible (Type 3) stranding is used in Ancor Marine Grade wire. The Ancor HD lugs are made for this type of flexible Marine grade wire. All my lugs and Ancor boxes from West Marine are on the boat 120 miles from here so I do not know what marking are on the lugs or Ancor boxes they where sold in. Ancor makes a crimper for insulated lugs up to 10awg. This is a double crimping tool. Not sure what they recommend for their uninsulated HD lugs. Might be worth it to call them to verify as they meet the Marine boating code but not sure about NEC codes. I would like to see MidNite eliminate these screw terminal and provide for lug connections for the Classic CC.  Boat owners have no choice but to use Marine Grade flexible wire or fail Marine surveys for insurance required by most marinas.
Just my $.02

[kauaisolarman]

thank you.

i just wanted to make sure that the Lugs im using are designed to be used with the fine stranded marine wire.

I dont have to worry about any inspections so i am just going to make sure that all the wires/components that i am using are at least UL rated.



 

[sigp2101]

cables from battery all the way through to inverter is 2AWG.  80A breaket will be used between the battery and the main power busbar, then 60A breaker between main bus bar and inverter.  all running 2awg wire.

this 48V system is only intended to run an air conditioner (6000btu 500watts max draw) and refridgerator (another 600w max).  inverter is a cotex 2000watt so max amps it would see is 42@48V..

Out of curiosity, your inverter will never be able to pull more than 41.6 A from your batt bank. Why are you using higher rating breaker than that? (60 A) I would use way less than max inverter Amps rating on both sides of input-output. To protect wiring and equipment you have to create bottlenecks aka breakers. For example if your inverter is capable of 18A on output side you will limit that to 10-15 amps so it will never work at max for prolonged period of time.
To stay safe you always oversize wire and under size breakers. This will prevent melting wires and fire hazard in equipment.

[Powerplay]

To stay safe you always oversize wire and under size breakers.

Or size the breaker correctly to the wire it protects.

[CDN-VT]

Some ONE have the controls,, to have a like , thumbs up etc.


IS there an EASY wat to have a vote / thumbs up  area on this forum
VT

[TomW]

Some ONE have the controls,, to have a like , thumbs up etc.
Were a small bit behind ,, BUT dot test B4
Wind sun suck &
12 YO kids do NOT KNOW !!! LEARN & CHEAK
VT

CDN-VT;


Can an old fart get that translated to American English?

I just don't understand the abbreviations and slang these days. I got the 12 year old kid bit but the rest blew by like a 10 year old on a dirt bike. I "think" it has to do with online "experts", which I ain't.

Tom

[ClassicCrazy]

Ultra flexible (Type 3) stranding is used in Ancor Marine Grade wire. The Ancor HD lugs are made for this type of flexible Marine grade wire. All my lugs and Ancor boxes from West Marine are on the boat 120 miles from here so I do not know what marking are on the lugs or Ancor boxes they where sold in. Ancor makes a crimper for insulated lugs up to 10awg. This is a double crimping tool. Not sure what they recommend for their uninsulated HD lugs. Might be worth it to call them to verify as they meet the Marine boating code but not sure about NEC codes. I would like to see MidNite eliminate these screw terminal and provide for lug connections for the Classic CC.  Boat owners have no choice but to use Marine Grade flexible wire or fail Marine surveys for insurance required by most marinas.
Just my $.02

John - I am curious why on marine their code always wants that fine stranded wire ? Is there some logical reason like it handles bouncing around in ocean swells better ?

Larry

[Resthome]

Ultra flexible (Type 3) stranding is used in Ancor Marine Grade wire. The Ancor HD lugs are made for this type of flexible Marine grade wire. All my lugs and Ancor boxes from West Marine are on the boat 120 miles from here so I do not know what marking are on the lugs or Ancor boxes they where sold in. Ancor makes a crimper for insulated lugs up to 10awg. This is a double crimping tool. Not sure what they recommend for their uninsulated HD lugs. Might be worth it to call them to verify as they meet the Marine boating code but not sure about NEC codes. I would like to see MidNite eliminate these screw terminal and provide for lug connections for the Classic CC.  Boat owners have no choice but to use Marine Grade flexible wire or fail Marine surveys for insurance required by most marinas.
Just my $.02

John - I am curious why on marine their code always wants that fine stranded wire ? Is there some logical reason like it handles bouncing around in ocean swells better ?

Larry

Larry

A wire could hardly find a more hostile environment than aboard a boat. On-board wiring is salted and doused, shaken and whipped, crushed and abraded, exposed to sunlight, subjected to heat, and coated with petroleum.  House wiring will long endure these conditions.

Never use solid wire on a boat. Wave or motor induced oscillations eventually fracture solid wire. Boat wiring must have the flexibility stranding provides. Boat owners should use only the most flexible wire, called Type 3. I believe most marine wire is Class K (Type 3) 30 AWG copper tinned strands which is very flexible.

The wire must be copper, but even copper corrodes in the marine environment, and corrosion is the primary cause of electrical failures on a boat. Plating each strand of the wire with a thin coat of tin â€" called tinning â€" dramatically improves corrosion resistance. The additional cost of tinned wire is nominal, the benefits substantial.

[ClassicCrazy]

I thought there must be a good reason - thanks for the explanation John. But if it is good enough for boats you would think it would be good enough for home use too.

[Resthome]

I thought there must be a good reason - thanks for the explanation John. But if it is good enough for boats you would think it would be good enough for home use too.

Oh I think it's good enough for home, just more expensive in most cases. The draw back is the terminal block and bus bars that use a screw to tighten down on the small stranded wires may come loose after time.