To twin or not to twin?

[Roadtripp]

I'm happy to join the group after reading for a few days. Steep newbie learning curve so I appreciate any guidance. I found one 3 year old post from Mario that seems to have helped get the firmware 1497 Kids twinned but I'm wondering if separating might be better because one array is flat on the roof and the other is nearly vertical on the wall. This shows my ignorance on how they twin to function as a single 60 amp cc. Also the modules on the roof are different than the wall. I do plan on welding some hinges so the flat roof panels can be tilted. The wall panels are already hinged but are vertical most of the time.
When wiring I was in a hurry, shame on me, and the PV in and battery out wires are not exactly the same length, but within a few inches, not precise as suggested by Mario. I had the Kids briefly in my old school bus with a 12 volt system but separate, not twinned. When I tried to twin them in the new cargo trailer 24 volt system I had to do the factory reset, turn of, repeat,....sequence Mario recommended because the OVR light would appear on the master and they would stop producing power.
Long story short, I'm not sure this is configured optimally yet. I just checked them again and they are still producing. No OVR. Thanks

[Westbranch]

well the FW is a ways ahead of those units, 1860 is the newest version. Recommend a FW update and then try the twinning. 
Those arrays need to be optimized as much as possible if it can be done as being mobile mounted each move is not going to be optimal IMO...

[ClassicCrazy]

I seem to remember there was some issue with twinning the Kids that a firmware update fixed . Someone wrote a detailed forum post on how to set them up correctly .

http://midniteftp.com/forum/index.php?topic=3721.msg35990#msg35990

Larry

[Roadtripp]

Thanks Westbranch and Classccrazy. This morning the system woke up, no LEDs. Errors, or over voltage. However, after reading the manual again I'm going to switch to Sync mode from Twin mode so only the outputs are parallel. Then compare input and output from the cc's.
Unable to update firmware currently. I only have a tablet at present.
Then in a new thread if needed I'll be redefining the battery charge and WB Jr parameters better for these AGM VRLA  batteries. Battery Vabs was going to 29.7 this morning with battery temp reading at 10 C. When I built the system it made sense to add the remote temp sensor as its mobile, uninsulated, and could get hot or cold in a cargo trailer.

[ClassicCrazy]

Also you should update the firmware - there were known bugs in the older versions that had been corrected.

Larry

[Roadtripp]

Ok, thanks, I haven't done firmware updates in anything before. I almost adopted a cheap used notebook PC from a friend. Wish I had done.
Yes, I think I found a bug when I tried switching from Twin to Sync. Heard repeated clicking and buzzing so quickly set it back to Twin mode. For testing tried switching off one PV array and it put out only slightly less power. But it's anecdotal with not much load and lots of variables. I'll test it with the inverter under more load.
Learning a lot. Oh, sorry, my firmware is 1797 not 1497 as previously stated.

[Westbranch]

Just to sure, if you borrow a laptop for an hour or so, it's best if you get one with W10... the new W10 loader works like a charm for the Classics and seem to remember the 'new guy' rewrote both for the Classics and the KID...

[ClassicCrazy]

There is a special step to do for the Kid when using Windows 10 -  it is documented in the software download page for the firmware. Make sure you follow the instructions exactly !  If you don't do the first step correctly when you go to the firmware update menu on the Kid it will start jumping connection in and out of the computer - like if you had a mouse plugged into the computer and unplugged it and then plugged it back in over and over real quickly. But if you follow those instructions when you plug the Kid into your computer it will show up in Windows explorer just like anything else you plug in . You just drag the new firmware into the Kid folder that showed up and it updates. Pretty easy unless you don't do that one step called for in instructions.

Larry

[krementz]

For the firmware update, remember you need to find an obsolete "mini" USB connector. The manual says it is supplied with the Classic; it isn't. This cable was discontinued about 7 years ago, but you can still find it on Amazon. It is NOT a "micro" cable, used for cell phones, nor a printer cable.

You may need a mirror and a flashlight to find the USB mini connection on the Classic; I did. The cable inserts vertically, not horizontally.

BTW, the newest non-beta firmware (without voice) is 2126, which was released about a year ago. The voice option takes much longer (like hours) to install; I would avoid the voice option. You can add it later if you want it for some reason. I always recommend the newest (stable) firmware available, it reduces the options during trouble shooting

[Vic]

For the firmware update, remember you need to find an obsolete "mini" USB connector. The manual says it is supplied with the Classic; it isn't. This cable was discontinued about 7 years ago, but you can still find it on Amazon. It is NOT a "micro" cable, used for cell phones, nor a printer cable.

You may need a mirror and a flashlight to find the USB mini connection on the Classic; I did. The cable inserts vertically, not horizontally.

BTW, the newest non-beta firmware (without voice) is 2126, which was released about a year ago. The voice option takes much longer (like hours) to install; I would avoid the voice option. You can add it later if you want it for some reason. I always recommend the newest (stable) firmware available, it reduces the options during trouble shooting

The above may well be fairly accurate,   depending upon one's installation,   etc  FOR THE CLASSIC CHARGE CONTROLLER.

However,  the MidNite KID CC is a completely different CC.   Here is a short Video with info on how to Update the KID Firmware:

http://www.midnitesolar.com/video/videoPlay.php?video_ID=111&videoCat_ID=20

FWIW,    Vic

[ClassicCrazy]

I have a whole bunch of those mini usb cords - they were used lots for cell phones and gps units in the past . One place to get them  - visit where ever they recycle old cell phones and ask - they will have a hundred of  them. Or go to Bestbuy and stick your hand in the cord recycling bin in the entry way to the store and probably find some there . Or probably a buck or two for one shipped via ebay .

Larry

[Roadtripp]

Ookie dokie, "mini B" cord is on my shopping list for updating my Kids. Unfortunately the picture on the video was too blurry to see the shape of the plug. Will look it up. Thank you all your high voltage input. Thanks for the heads up.
One thing that just came to mind is the static here in the dry air desert. Is that a concern for handling integrated circuits? How can one ground a trailer anyway. Then there's surges. I'll start searching for the threads on these topics.
The kids are powering the bread machine here in the desert.

[ClassicCrazy]

If you aren't poking around at the circuit boards you should be okay . But if you think you may have some static make sure you touch something metal to discharge yourself before you plug that cord in . I always left mine plugged in and just tuck the end off to the side somewhere so that every time there is an update don't have open it up the Kid again . Attached is photo of the different usb cords so you know which one it looks like.


Larry

[Westbranch]

Mini USB plugs are not so obsolete.

I have 2, new to me from the store in last 2 years, that  both use the MINI plug, an Android phone and Android tablet...

[krementz]

"the Mini-A connector and the Mini-AB receptacle connector are deprecated (i.e. de-certified, but standardized) since May 2007."

see http://www.usb.org/developers/Deprecation_Announcement_052507.pdf and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Mini_connectors regarding "mini" connectors.

You can still buy them, but I am surprised anyone is still making equipment that uses them (other than Midnite).