Author Topic: Charging with Classic  (Read 1341 times)

Westbranch

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #45 on: March 17, 2018, 04:24:49 PM »
A good ABSORB  period is essential to a complete charge,.... you did not say if you are getting cold winter weather right now, so if you are  ....the only way to get to the ABSORB target with low incoming PV power, without the WBjr  is to use an estimate of the additional time it takes, in the summer you should not have any issue...
 
So leave the settings as is till after the equinox that will be here in about a week... get the WBjr and enjoy...
« Last Edit: March 17, 2018, 09:15:13 PM by Westbranch »
KID FW1811 560W >C&D 24V 900Ah AGM
CL150 29032 V.2126-NW2097-GP2133 175A E-Panel WBjr, 3Px4s 140W > 24V 900Ah AGM,
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ClassicCrazy

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #46 on: March 17, 2018, 08:55:35 PM »
Mymidnite graphs will give you a good approximation of what it going on with the batteries if you don't have a load on them at the time they are charging.
Sounds from what you said they are filling up in about 2 hours absorb time.  You don't want to over charge AGM batteries . AGM will also charge , but more slowly when they are floating . So if it was me I would lower the Absorb Time to 2 hours , and then confirm everything when you get the Whizbang - sooner you get that the better . Of course you also need to get the shunt along with Whizbang installed in the negative of  your system with only one connection on one side of shunt going the the battery .

Larry
system one
Classic 150 , 5s4p  Kyocera 135watt , 12s Soneil 2v 540amp lead crystal for 24v pack , Outback 3524 inverter
system two
Classic 150 ,5s 135 watt Kyocero , 16s Calb 100AH LiFePO4 , Outback VFX 3648 inverter
system three
Midnite KID MPPT 24 DC in to  12 volt AGM batterie

Westbranch

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #47 on: March 17, 2018, 09:20:21 PM »
Here is a document link  for my AGMs.. it explains a lot about FLAs and AGMs  construction and operation

http://www.cdtechno.com/pdf/ref/41_2128_0212.pdf

and the home page for that document

http://www.cdtechno.com/resource/support_doc.html

lots of good reading
KID FW1811 560W >C&D 24V 900Ah AGM
CL150 29032 V.2126-NW2097-GP2133 175A E-Panel WBjr, 3Px4s 140W > 24V 900Ah AGM,
2 Cisco WRT54GL i/c DD-WRT Rtr, NetGr DS104Hub Hughes 1100 Sat. Modem
Cotek ST1500 Inv  want a 24V  ROSIE Inverter
OmniCharge3024  Eu1/2/3000iGens
West Chilcotin 1680+W to come

Matrix

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #48 on: March 18, 2018, 12:38:52 PM »
Here is a document link  for my AGMs.. it explains a lot about FLAs and AGMs  construction and operation

http://www.cdtechno.com/pdf/ref/41_2128_0212.pdf

and the home page for that document

http://www.cdtechno.com/resource/support_doc.html

lots of good reading
That is one of the most informative things I have read on the subject of charging ... and trust me ... I have read a lot.
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REC TwinPeak 2 285W 3S-3P 2565w-STC 1926w-NMOT Array / Classic 150 / Conext SW 4024 Inverter
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blevac

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #49 on: March 18, 2018, 04:00:39 PM »

So leave the settings as is till after the equinox that will be here in about a week... get the WBjr and enjoy...

So if it was me I would lower the Absorb Time to 2 hours , and then confirm everything when you get the Whizbang - sooner you get that the better . Of course you also need to get the shunt along with Whizbang installed in the negative of  your system with only one connection on one side of shunt going the the battery .

Larry

Interesting, two different recommendations for the absorb time. It does seem that absorb time is one of those grey areas with different opinions. But there is definitely consensus on getting a WhizBangJr . I was going to wait to order one with the balance of my system and ground racks in a month or so but I think I'll go ahead and get that in right away.

Of course you also need to get the shunt along with Whizbang installed in the negative of  your system with only one connection on one side of shunt going the the battery .

Larry
   
Yes, I do already have a shunt installed for the Magnum BMK.

So I decided to play it safe and went out today today and lowered the absorb time to 2.5Hrs which seems to be a safe time to get to the 5.8A range for my bank. I'll keep an eye on it for a few days and will hopefully be able to get the WBJr installed within a week or so if it's in stock at my local supplier.

Thanks for the document links Westbranch, perfect read for a Sunday afternoon. And thanks both of you for the information!
5.5kW Offgrid Earthship -
24 x 230W Sharp ND230, 2 x Classic 150, 1 x Classic 200, Magnum MS4024PAE 4K inverter, MNE-240 E-Panel, 6500W remote start generator, 8 Full River AGM batteries (830AH).

Westbranch

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #50 on: March 18, 2018, 06:27:59 PM »
When you install the WBjr, watch and see how long the ABSORB time is to 5.4 or what ever value you settle on and note the battery temp and ambient temps... the choice will then go from  an And/Or situation, ie whichever value comes first to a hard 5.4 A or ?? value chosen, time is overridden;)
KID FW1811 560W >C&D 24V 900Ah AGM
CL150 29032 V.2126-NW2097-GP2133 175A E-Panel WBjr, 3Px4s 140W > 24V 900Ah AGM,
2 Cisco WRT54GL i/c DD-WRT Rtr, NetGr DS104Hub Hughes 1100 Sat. Modem
Cotek ST1500 Inv  want a 24V  ROSIE Inverter
OmniCharge3024  Eu1/2/3000iGens
West Chilcotin 1680+W to come

blevac

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #51 on: March 18, 2018, 06:41:49 PM »
Got it thanks! Makes sense. I think the WBJr will really help, especially in the spring when I add the other 20 panels and 2 Classics. Right now so little is going in and out my batteries that the temps barely move and absorb starts about an hour after sunrise.

I'm having a blast with this stuff! This is way better than my day job : )
5.5kW Offgrid Earthship -
24 x 230W Sharp ND230, 2 x Classic 150, 1 x Classic 200, Magnum MS4024PAE 4K inverter, MNE-240 E-Panel, 6500W remote start generator, 8 Full River AGM batteries (830AH).

CDN-VT

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #52 on: March 18, 2018, 10:04:14 PM »
When you hear fans run , you'll feel the move .

WBjr is an eye opener to the Classic & you .

WestBranch  and I will send a  smoke retrieval balloon !!


Be safe and double check , if in doubt , post here as we all have needed help to see the direction .


VT
Canadian Solar 350W 37.6 VOC  30.6 VMP 8.22 ISC 7.87 IMP ,-15 c +30c max  4 strings in 2 in Series for 24v Classic 150 -1020 Ah  Freezers & fridges ~~~ Second Array same panels of 3sx3 parallel for 24 V Classic 150 -440 Ah Outback Barns & out blds.
48Vdc almost done,11Strings up of 3s11P same panels

blevac

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #53 on: March 23, 2018, 05:38:13 PM »
Thanks guys!

I got the WBJr installed today. I have an e-mail in to Full River to see if they have any specific info for efficiency and temp compensation for battery capacity. Right now I went with 95% for efficiency and 1% /1C.  The one parameter I saw on the Classic that I haven't seen mentioned is the value for rebulk. Is this a value setting in Amps that determines when bulk mode kicks in? The default is 8A, so if I am in absorb or float and I start drawing more than 8A it kicks back to bulk?  Or is this something else? How do you determine the value for this?

5.5kW Offgrid Earthship -
24 x 230W Sharp ND230, 2 x Classic 150, 1 x Classic 200, Magnum MS4024PAE 4K inverter, MNE-240 E-Panel, 6500W remote start generator, 8 Full River AGM batteries (830AH).

ClassicCrazy

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #54 on: March 23, 2018, 07:46:59 PM »
Rebulk is a voltage not current setting . It is if the voltage drops down real low during the day after it has already gone through Absorb and Float. I never changed it and I don't think most people use this feature . Sure I will get corrected if I am wrong.

Watch your SOC and if it is getting to 100% before all the amps you have used are filled back in then you know you have to change the efficiency  . You want it to more or less match .

Larry
system one
Classic 150 , 5s4p  Kyocera 135watt , 12s Soneil 2v 540amp lead crystal for 24v pack , Outback 3524 inverter
system two
Classic 150 ,5s 135 watt Kyocero , 16s Calb 100AH LiFePO4 , Outback VFX 3648 inverter
system three
Midnite KID MPPT 24 DC in to  12 volt AGM batterie

Vic

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #55 on: March 23, 2018, 07:49:30 PM »
Hi belevac,

ReBulk  (RB),   is a voltage setting.  When the battery voltage falls to the value of this voltage setting,  the Classic will begin a second Bulk charging stage for that day.

The Default  is 8 V,   which effectively turns OFF ReBulk.

IMO,   ReBulk is not often used.   But,  for systems with limited battery capacity,   or special situations,  RB can be useful.

If you choose to use it,   RB  needs to be set below Vflt.

Battery efficiencies for AGM batteries are usually in the mid,  to low 90% range.

Fullriver should also tell you the Reference Temperature.  It is usually 25 degrees C.  This is the turning point for temperature compensation,   and also used when calculating battery Capacity vs temperature.

Also,  in the Charge>Limits menu  you will probably want to set Limits on  Temperature Compensation for charging by the Classic  --  Fullriver should be able to tell you this,   as well.

Some of these battery characteristics are noted on the manufacturer's DataSheet.

My 2c,   Vic
Off Grid - Two systems -- 4 SW+ 5548s, Surrette 4KS25 1280 AH X2@48V, 11.1 KW STC PV, 3X MidNite Classic 150 w/ WBjrs, Beta KID on S-530s, MX-60s, MN Bkrs/Boxes.  Thanks MN for Great Products/Service/Support!

blevac

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Re: Charging with Classic
« Reply #56 on: March 24, 2018, 09:39:17 AM »
Thanks again! So I will leave rebulk off. I heard back from Full River within a few hours. In case someone searches for it efficiency for the DC400-6 is 95% and capacity change per degree Celcius is 0.16%.  All other pertinent data is shown on their spec sheet or product webpage.

Watch your SOC and if it is getting to 100% before all the amps you have used are filled back in then you know you have to change the efficiency  . You want it to more or less match .
Larry

Good tip thanks! I guess I will be able to adjust this as the battery bank ages to keep my Remaining AH display a bit more accurate.
5.5kW Offgrid Earthship -
24 x 230W Sharp ND230, 2 x Classic 150, 1 x Classic 200, Magnum MS4024PAE 4K inverter, MNE-240 E-Panel, 6500W remote start generator, 8 Full River AGM batteries (830AH).