Author Topic: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic  (Read 379 times)

Boompy

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Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« on: June 11, 2018, 11:28:28 PM »
Hi all,

Is anybody able to confirm the actual temperature operating range for the Classic 150.

I've seen some conflicting reports that range between -40C to 40C (in the manual) and -40C to 50C (on the spec sheet).

Can anybody advise an official range?

Thanks

boB

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2018, 12:57:59 AM »

Yes, the Classic will operate between those two temperature ranges...  -40C to +50C  ~BUT~ above +25C, the Classic may reduce its maximum output current to keep its internal components from rising above predetermined--set temperatures. 

The max FET temperature is somewhere around 80 to 90 degrees C (can't remember exactly).  i.e. The full power output current along with the input voltage is specified at 25 degrees C ambient.  As the ambient temperature rises, and the Classic is at maximum power, the FET temperature will also rise, and on a minute by minute basis, the output sliding current limit will drop by 5 amps at a time until the temperature stops rising.  Then as the internal temperatures fall a few degrees below the limit, the sliding current limit will come back up again.

At LOW temperatures, or somewhere around -10 or -20 degrees C, the MNGP LCD display will start to freeze and stop displaying correctly.  The LCD will come back to life as the temperature rises again.  The buttons should still work, but you just won't be able to see what you're doing very well.

Hope this helps a bit.
boB

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Boompy

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2018, 11:26:48 AM »
Brilliant response Bob

That's more than I asked for and very insightful, I genuinely appreciate the detailed response

Thankyou!

boB

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2018, 04:17:40 PM »
You're welcome, Boompy with two O's  !!!

boB  (with one "O")

:)
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Matrix

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2018, 04:34:52 PM »
boB, my FETs here in early summer are seeing 62-65*C with ambient Temps around 90*F at the CC. And the FETs never cool below 46*C at nite.

At that hi an FET am I slowly killing my classic?
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REC TwinPeak 2 285W 3S-3P 2565w-STC 1926w-NMOT Array / Classic 150 / Conext SW 4024 Inverter
Trojan L16H-AC 435Ah bank 4S  with 7' of 4/0 cable
24 volt system /  Need 3200Whs Daily
My System Install

boB

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2018, 05:26:20 PM »
boB, my FETs here in early summer are seeing 62-65*C with ambient Temps around 90*F at the CC. And the FETs never cool below 46*C at nite.

At that hi an FET am I slowly killing my classic?

I doubt it.  Not much anyway...  Did you know that the DIE inside the FETs are good for (minimum) 175 degrees C  ?

That night-time temperature comes from the auxiliary power supply and a couple of ICs in there...  This idle power comes from all the extra stuff (features ?) in there like Ethernet, Arc fault, RS232 circuitry, etc...  And maybe the MNGP too.   There is a wee bit of circuitry to reduce idle power from the Arc Fault board but hasn't been implemented because it takes work (time)

How much power/current are you putting out during the day ?

boB

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Matrix

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2018, 11:54:17 PM »

How much power/current are you putting out during the day ?

boB
- The total system produces about 12.9 kWhs Max (most ever in a single day) and about 3-7 kWhs on cloudy days for both loads and charging per day
- I have seen the array produce 2432 watts at any given moment in time (saw this number for the first time last week - highest the array has every produced), but the normal max hi watts from the array is between 1850 and 2150 watts for about 3 hours around hi noon without clouds.
- The voltage coming into the CC from the array is set up for 115v and usually ranges around 70-88v during the day
- I produce about 65-70 charging/load amps from the CC at max production at any given time
- and my loads once I hit opportunity/diversion are about 1100-1600 watts that is produced from the array

By the time I go to opportunity/waste-not when the water heater kicks in the FETs have cooled to around 58*C or less.  charging needs has usually dropped to about 25 amps and falling.  The FETs only hit 62-65*C when producing max amps when I am in bulk and max charging.

I have a 4" PC fan on the Classic that is on a timer that comes on at 8am and goes off at 8pm.  The charge controller is mounted on a massive 1" thick aluminum heat sink
« Last Edit: June 12, 2018, 11:58:34 PM by Matrix »
Grid-Assist Off-Grid
REC TwinPeak 2 285W 3S-3P 2565w-STC 1926w-NMOT Array / Classic 150 / Conext SW 4024 Inverter
Trojan L16H-AC 435Ah bank 4S  with 7' of 4/0 cable
24 volt system /  Need 3200Whs Daily
My System Install

australsolarier

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2018, 08:28:00 PM »
i do not go over 60 degrees C even with 95 A. my power room is air conditioned. and each midnite classic has an external fan underneath. hopefully this will delay having to change the internal fans indefinitively .
yes, the aircon costs money. but if it prolongs the life of the lifepo4 battery for just 10%, it has paid for itself. not to mention the caps in the chargers and inverters and other electronic gear.

boB

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2018, 02:28:43 AM »
i do not go over 60 degrees C even with 95 A. my power room is air conditioned. and each midnite classic has an external fan underneath. hopefully this will delay having to change the internal fans indefinitively .
yes, the aircon costs money. but if it prolongs the life of the lifepo4 battery for just 10%, it has paid for itself. not to mention the caps in the chargers and inverters and other electronic gear.

You must be using a 12V battery ?  That will tend to run cooler than a higher voltage battery bank.  This is why the Classic is rated for a higher output current at a lower output and input voltage.

Matrix, what was your battery voltage ?

boB
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australsolarier

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2018, 03:10:38 AM »
one midnite is used for the 12V system
3 midnites are used for the 48V system
the 3 other midnite classic also do not go over 60 C whist at their limit, 84 or 86 amps.

the last 20% really pushes up the temperatures.

Matrix

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2018, 06:51:09 AM »
boB (loving the new Icon) ... my battery / system voltage is 24v
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REC TwinPeak 2 285W 3S-3P 2565w-STC 1926w-NMOT Array / Classic 150 / Conext SW 4024 Inverter
Trojan L16H-AC 435Ah bank 4S  with 7' of 4/0 cable
24 volt system /  Need 3200Whs Daily
My System Install

boB

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2018, 05:34:02 PM »
boB (loving the new Icon) ... my battery / system voltage is 24v

Thanks ! :)

24V....  Yeah.  Not that high of V really.   Kinda middle of the road V.

boB
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Matrix

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2018, 08:03:28 AM »
boB, my FETs here in early summer are seeing 62-65*C with ambient Temps around 90*F at the CC. And the FETs never cool below 46*C at nite.

At that hi an FET am I slowly killing my classic?
And so does that mean the FET temps are also middle of the road?
Grid-Assist Off-Grid
REC TwinPeak 2 285W 3S-3P 2565w-STC 1926w-NMOT Array / Classic 150 / Conext SW 4024 Inverter
Trojan L16H-AC 435Ah bank 4S  with 7' of 4/0 cable
24 volt system /  Need 3200Whs Daily
My System Install

boB

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2018, 01:38:09 AM »
boB, my FETs here in early summer are seeing 62-65*C with ambient Temps around 90*F at the CC. And the FETs never cool below 46*C at nite.

At that hi an FET am I slowly killing my classic?
And so does that mean the FET temps are also middle of the road?

Yep.  That's basically what it means. 

boB
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ZoNiE

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Re: Official Temperature Operation Range for Classic
« Reply #14 on: June 17, 2018, 07:53:01 PM »

<Snip>

At LOW temperatures, or somewhere around -10 or -20 degrees C, the MNGP LCD display will start to freeze and stop displaying correctly.  The LCD will come back to life as the temperature rises again.  The buttons should still work, but you just won't be able to see what you're doing very well.

boB

Perhaps you guys may want to consider putting a little heat sink behind the LCD and tying it to the main one for uber-cold climates to keep that LCD warm. LOL.

My FET Temp is around 50C when the SOC is 100%, Ambient is around 80F. I guess this is OK, but it prompts me to leave the closet door open where the Classic is stored. (Closet in a large bath in an RV with the roof vent also open.)
Update:
1996 Safari Sahara Class A Motorhome with:
4X Hanhwa 280W panels
1X Midnight Classic-150
4X  Dying WallyWorld Energizer GC2's bought by the PO
1X 2,000W Heart Interface Freedom 20 Inverter/Charger (OEM)
1X Onan Emerald 6300LP RV Genset