Clocks went forward an hour today at 2am. Long days and summertime begins ;D
Computers, laptops, Ipad, digital wall clock, Iphone all adjusted time automatically.
The only clocks I could find that did not update were the Classics.
Now, once upon a lot of firmware revisions ago there was a timezone setup option. Now gone, but that would have been nice to help some firmware auto summertime clock updates.
Any possibility of getting something done with the Classic's clock? No rush, next change is six months away :)
dgd
Probably because:
the switch to Standard time does not change here till the first Saturday night/Sunday AM in NOVEMBER this year, more than a week late this year...???
Its actually pretty tricky to do, because idiot feather picking mop heads keep messing with the damned daylight time dates. The only way you could do it long term is to via a network, and theres no guaranteed net connection for classics. I suspect it would also be a fair bit of code. I dont think the classics time really does all that much. Midnight tasks. Logging timestamps, etc.
Maybe a better idea is just to leave it in std time time year round.
What does mymidnite do with the graphing? Blackbox messes with the x axis and keeps the curve going. Spot the 0,1,3,4...
I'm not sure it is actually tricky or difficult to do. Ipad, Win8 and my LG tv only need setup of timezone and they get the changes spot on. Ok, they are all internet connected but so is my Classics.
I just noticed the clock/date on my Electrolux steam oven has also changed. Its internet connected too to allow remote oven activation. And of course the Porsche 911 clock had updated
The Classics are making yellow boxes on local app...
dgd
Yeah but those devices all are microprocessor class devices rather then microcontrollers. With an internet connection plus a half gig of ram, you can do all sorts of things.
Local app yellow? What local app was that again....
Quote from: zoneblue on September 28, 2014, 06:34:11 PM
Local app yellow? What local app was that again....
Midnite's Local App for PC (at least) shows a yellow background when the PC and controller disagree on time / date.
Tom
Unfortunately DST is a major PITA for programmers. There are libraries and libraries and algorithms and online services, but they are all out of the range of capabilities for our little CC. We elected to make the time changeable on the Classic so the user can adjust it as necessary. We toyed with the idea of putting in a NIST lookup, but it ended up being more algorithmically intensive than almost anything else the Classic does.
MyMidNite uses Unix timestamps for everything using the actual server time that data is received from the Classic and not the time on the Classic itself. I will probably add a DST feature to MyMidNite since we have access to all the libraries up on the server.
I did the time feature for a digital TV ASIC a few lifetimes ago. The code for world DST auto adjust ended up being more than the code for parsing the MPEG streams to obtain actual TV show data and schedules. In the end they dropped it since it was around the time the US was talking to moving to the new DST scheme.
Here is a much more qualified gentlemen than I discussing the joys of Timezones:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5wpm-gesOY&list=TLQGLcdBlFqCBGGCFtH3HiPtW3p4HqLx5w
Unfortunately the config in LocalApp for Classic time and date adjustment does not work. I can adjust time and use the return arrow to save it - and the info box changes from yellow to its normal blue. Looks good.
However, close the App then reopen it and the time has gone back to its previous setting with yellow box again.
Tried this on six Classics and the same happens
So is the only solution a 200Km round drive and a day's time to visit these six Classics (at different locations) to use the MNGP to correct the time? :o
Or am I missing something obvious?
So automated daylight savings time adjustment is complicated.
Perhaps a config MISC option in mngp for dates when clock goes forward/back and something similar in App?
dgd
DGD
Yes if you want to use the Local App to set the time you need to turn off TimeSync in the tweaks menu. Otherwise the Classic reads the MNGP and over writes what you set. We should have the commit button right it to both the classic and MNGP. (Andrew??)
No can do, unfortunately. The local app can't get to the MNGP. MNGP is a bus master only. Oh the joys of modbus.
that lost in time design decision to put the rtc with the mngp instead of on the Classic's main processor board. :P
20/20 hindsight is just wonderful ::)
dgd
Quote from: dgd on September 30, 2014, 04:22:16 AM
that lost in time design decision to put the rtc with the mngp instead of on the Classic's main processor board. :P
20/20 hindsight is just wonderful ::)
dgd
Can not disagree with that. In the future we need to try to put things like RTC's on the main unit so we can get to it :o
Yup, I am of the same mind.
So working with Andrew this AM we are going to give you a tick box to disable timesync. Then we will grey out the time adjustment on the Local App when time sync is enabled. This will make it as useable as possible I think.
We will then have the time and date on the MNGP go away when time sync is off. Replaced with a message saying "TimeSync Disabled see Tweaks"
Ryan
Quote from: Halfcrazy on September 30, 2014, 06:18:31 AM
So working with Andrew this AM we are going to give you a tick box to disable timesync. Then we will grey out the time adjustment on the Local App when time sync is enabled. This will make it as useable as possible I think.
Thats an excellent idea, and will make remote time adjustment via app possible.
Thanks for this.
dgd
The RTC battery cannot go on the Classic board. There was no room left to put it there.
Having the battery on the MNGP was not a mistake. It was planned that way.
However, the Local App was not originally planned to do time/date either.
But, also, the time/date issue was not planned to be a PITA for you guys.
boB
Interesting you mention the battery for the RTC - I often wondered why this was considered necessary on a device designed to be permanently connected to a reliable power source, ie a battery bank.
I realize each time the Classic is power cycled the time/date settings would be lost (as happens with Classic Lite), but its real easy to re-enter these values when a necessary power cycle is needed such as firmware upgrading.
So I think the RTC battery is really a non-issue. Its dead in one of my C150s but I have never bothered replacing it.
So without the battery could the RTC ic not have found room on the main board?
Maybe in next board revision? or even a teensy pcb with RTC on top of main pcb
similar to that tiny extra pcb in the Classic 250 at top of main pcb?
(Maybe also just a two pin header on pcb for wiring an optional external rtc battery)
just overthinking as usual ::) maybe an RTC is functionless anyway, the firmware could check for internet connection then just go read time server for date/time, but this would need the Classic to identify the time zone it is in :o
dgd
..or perhaps a reverse dns lookup on Classics IP number or subnet would reveal the ip address/domain to determine the origin country and hence timezone information.
dgd
Quote from: dgd on October 01, 2014, 01:03:59 AM
..or perhaps a reverse dns lookup on Classics IP number or subnet would reveal the ip address/domain to determine the origin country and hence timezone information.
dgd
For this one, I suggest you watch the yootoob video that Andrew posted. It's right on and very interesting to
geeks like you and me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5wpm-gesOY&list=TLQGLcdBlFqCBGGCFtH3HiPtW3p4HqLx5w
Quote from: dgd on October 01, 2014, 01:03:59 AM
Interesting you mention the battery for the RTC - I often wondered why this was considered necessary on a device designed to be permanently connected to a reliable power source, ie a battery bank.
I realize each time the Classic is power cycled the time/date settings would be lost (as happens with Classic Lite), but its real easy to re-enter these values when a necessary power cycle is needed such as firmware upgrading.
So I think the RTC battery is really a non-issue. Its dead in one of my C150s but I have never bothered replacing it.
The Trace Engineering SW inverter/charger was this way. It would also not remember its settings
as well as time. We had lots of complaints about that. Wasn't going to let that happen again.
I even made an external powering dongle that required a 9V battery to keep up the system
when the power went out. I think we sold quite a few of those.
Quote from: dgd on October 01, 2014, 01:03:59 AM
So without the battery could the RTC ic not have found room on the main board?
Maybe in next board revision? or even a teensy pcb with RTC on top of main pcb
similar to that tiny extra pcb in the Classic 250 at top of main pcb?
(Maybe also just a two pin header on pcb for wiring an optional external rtc battery)
just overthinking as usual ::) maybe an RTC is functionless anyway, the firmware could check for internet connection then just go read time server for date/time, but this would need the Classic to identify the time zone it is in :o
The RTC is not a separate chip. It's in the processor. It does have its own 32,768 Hz xtal though.
Any extra PCBs, even teeny tiny ones would raise the price. There is already the MNGP with
the battery and another processor on it that can take the place of that PCB, although it would
be nice to be able to have the battery on either or both boards if wanted. The internal power
runs the MNGP clock when the battery goes dead as you have found.
Too much fun.
boB
Hm if the RTC is in the Processor on the control board it occurs to me we could remove the battery, change the programming slightly and have it done with. Magnum works this way when you boot the ARC50 it asks you to set the time. No TimeSync needed then.
Quote from: Halfcrazy on September 30, 2014, 06:18:31 AM
So working with Andrew this AM we are going to give you a tick box to disable timesync. Then we will grey out the time adjustment on the Local App when time sync is enabled. This will make it as useable as possible I think.
We will then have the time and date on the MNGP go away when time sync is off. Replaced with a message saying "TimeSync Disabled see Tweaks"
Ryan
Great. I'm off grid, and have no internet near the battery shed. So I'm very glad this is getting tweaked.
That was a great video on time zones !
Quote from: ClassicCrazy on October 03, 2014, 12:02:16 PM
That was a great video on time zones !
Yes, it REALLY tells a story, doesn't it ?
not really 'summer clock' , but has the time tweak been implemented yet?
my local app version is v0.3.61 (June 2014?) the updater does not seem to find a later one.
Quote from: Halfcrazy on September 30, 2014, 06:18:31 AM
So working with Andrew this AM we are going to give you a tick box to disable timesync. Then we will grey out the time adjustment on the Local App when time sync is enabled. This will make it as useable as possible I think.
We will then have the time and date on the MNGP go away when time sync is off. Replaced with a message saying "TimeSync Disabled see Tweaks"
Ryan
bump ?