*waves*
s/v Ninaa Ootakii is a power hungry beast...
System is 24v.
Bank is 8 L-16 Lead Acid batteries.
EQ: 32.3 Absorb 29.6 Float 27.0
Absorb time is 2:00
EQ time is 1:00
Charge controller is a Midnite Classic 150, about 6' from the panels and 5' from the battery bank.
System has an average constant 8.4a draw. (Drifts from 4a to 12a, all accounted for)
I have 2, 24v Midnite Solar Chinook Wind turbines installed on my forward mast (only place they would work).
Wiring is 10 awg, and about 14' electrically from the turbines to the dump load controllers.
The battery connection in the schematic is actually the forward end of 40' of 4 awg cable (ancor) that runs to the battery bank.
So, as I understand it, if I make this final connection, the turbine controllers will sense whatever my Classic 150 is doing ( EQ: 32.3 Absorb 29.6 Float 27.0 ) and promptly dump all the power it makes, to the dump loads.
Basically making them useless when the sun is up.
At night, they should charge as long as my bank isn't full.
None of this seems like it's supposed to work this way, so I'm guessing I'm missing something obvious.
Help? :)
Now I'm worried about all'y'all. I've never had a post sit this long unanswered, lol.
Tldr; How do I hide the voltage at my batteries from my wind turbine dump loads, so my solar doesn't cause my turbines to dump load all the power they make during the day?
Well, how to keep the dump loads from taking over during the day ?
What does the dump load controller or dump load switch consist of ? Is there an online manual we could look at ?
Does the controller have an input that can disable it from turning the dump load on with a logic signal of some sort ?
It may be possible that the Classic, using one of its Aux outputs, can make the dump load controller dump at a higher voltage that would be more reasonable for the charging stage you are presently in.
A Solid State Relay (SSR) controlled by the Classic's Aux may make that possible by using the Waste-Not mode which goes active when the battery voltage gets just above the charge stage voltage.
If the dump load controller voltage can be adjusted higher, that setup might still be good for a fail-safe in case the Classic should reset or something while the wind is blowing a big one.
boB
You are more likely to have a good manual for the dump load than I am, lol
(This is a pair of Midnite Solar Chinook wind turbines)
The manual I have is this one: https://www.midnitesolar.com/pdfs/10-331-1_REV_J_Chinook_200-MANUAL.pdf
At this point I'm well and truly stuck, and this seems to be one of those questions that either everyone knows the answer to, so no one writes it down, or it requires something arcane.
My current classic 150 settings are
EQ: 32.3 Absorb 29.6 Float 27.0
Absorb time is 2:00
EQ time is 1:00
So if we could tweak the dump load (they're MidNite Solar MNCDL300 's ) to measure higher than 29.6 at the battery bank that might work?
You are correct the dump load is a simple manual device and does not communicate with other controllers. It should be set up to be higher in set points than the solar controller, so it comes in as an emergency device. You would need to disable it while you EQ also.
If I were setting the system up, I would use a diversion load driven from the solar classics that comes online "Above" the setpoint like say using Waste Not High and set it to a positive offset, so the diversion only comes on when something pushed the battery above the solar controllers set point.
That all said if you set the chinook diversion controller to Con2- SLD and Con3-OVP it will regulate at 30.2vdc so that is above your 29.6 you would need to disable the controller when you EQ of course
I think my brain just slipped a gear, lol.
(I have no idea how to do it like you would do it)
... that said, I can figure out the jumpers and send it.
Thank you!
*sigh*
so got wind today, and the turbine brake switch definitely works.
(slow rotation of both turbines when on, normal when off)
with the solar panels disconnected, I was charging at 3a per the Wiz Bang Jr.
Further investigation shows that one of the diversion loads has an LED lit, that the other does not.
Both turbines and dump loads are configured identically.
What does this led being lit on one but not on the other mean?
(I think it says D2?)
Stone, could you get a picture of that whole circuit board ?
I would like to see what the part number of it is.
The number would start with an 8- something
Might be something like an 8-044-1 or similar.
boB
AhA ! I see now. It is a Kid clipper. I thought this was from a Classic clipper.
If I see the PCB part number (8-???-?) then I may be able to figure out what D2 LED means.
boB
I'm not sure where to look, these are the numbers I could find easily.
Actually, this is a MidNite dump load controller. I don't yet know or see what D2 is supposed to mean though.
Looking. If not today, I should be able to find what that means tomorrow.
boB
Thanks boB, I appreciate it.
*bump* :)
Does anyone have a schematic for the Chinook dump load controller?
Quote from: Stone on September 20, 2022, 09:57:27 PM
Does anyone have a schematic for the Chinook dump load controller?
Yes, if I can make sure I have the right PCB and rev.
I could not read the circuit board part number under the wire in this picture... And the Revision letter. I think the Rev is "A".
boB
I found it. The board is our 8-120-1 Revision A which it looks like you have.
As for LED D2, that is NOT screen printed on the PCB ! I do not know why !
I would have to find the software for this. I will look for it.
But here is the schematic for you anyway.
boB
Thanks boB.
It's on the schematic, column 8, row D.
It's also screen printed on my board.
Both my units are the same board rev.
It looks like there was a cap added after the picture in the manual of this controller was taken, it's just below it to the left.
Pics attached.
Yes, I looked at the code (assembly language)...
Looks like the green LED means that there are pulses coming into the load from the turbine and the RED LED shows that it is clipping or limiting.
Green--- Some wind
RED --- LOTS of wind
So, is your green LED ALWAYS on ? Or only on when the turbine is spinning ?
boB
This sounds like it's going to be fun :/
Brakes work on both turbines.
Wind is currently 7 to 10 mph across the deck.
Turbine 1 (starboard side)
No lights, ever.
Turbine 2 (port side)
Green light is always on.
(Even when the turbine isn't connected to it, like when the brake switch is on)
5 minutes ago, I shut off the panels, removed all the loads, and the wiz bang Jr is showing .2 to 1.4a with the turbines engaged.
I'm not sure either is working properly, but at least one of them appears to be charging.
I know I hate it when people say this to me but... with turbine 1. Have you tested voltage with a multimeter to make sure you have all the wires connected to the diversion load. Seeing that it has no lights ever.
If you feel like I might of sold you a faulty diversion piece. I do have a couple of them new in box still. I can send you one if you would like to see if that is a possibility. And I know when k am trying to figure out my own electrical problems. I always disconnect everything and test things one at a time.
So first I would recommend using a voltage meter on the wires connected to the diversion load where they are connected to the electrical board. That will be the first thing so I will know if i need tok send you a new one for both or just one.
Okay.
I'm not sure what I'm supposed to do here.
On both turbines, this reads 27.2, which is expected, because they're connected to the battery bank...
My question for you boB... With the load diversion for the Chinook. Is there any difference with the electrical board between the 12v, 24v, 48v? I know I have to move the jumper over to the proper voltage.... But can I use one that was with the 48v Chinook turbine, as one for a 24v system?
Quote from: The Ugly One on October 01, 2022, 10:03:46 PM
My question for you boB... With the load diversion for the Chinook. Is there any difference with the electrical board between the 12v, 24v, 48v? I know I have to move the jumper over to the proper voltage.... But can I use one that was with the 48v Chinook turbine, as one for a 24v system?
You can divert at 12, 24, 48V battery voltages and yes, you can connect up a 24V or 48V Chinook turbine to that battery and it will divert BUT the turbine, if is a 24V or 48V and connected to a 12V battery will most likely stall and not do much if anything at all.
An MPPT controller like the Classic will allow you to run a 24V or 48V turbine into a 12V battery. Or a 48V turbine into a 24V battery.
But a 48V turbine can connect directly to a 48V battery or 24V turbine directly to a 24V battery and use the simple battery diversion for those.
I may have missed something...
boB
Quote from: The Ugly One on October 01, 2022, 10:03:46 PM
My question for you boB... With the load diversion for the Chinook. Is there any difference with the electrical board between the 12v, 24v, 48v? I know I have to move the jumper over to the proper voltage.... But can I use one that was with the 48v Chinook turbine, as one for a 24v system?
They have different resistors in them to set the current draw so if you use a 12v on a 48v system it is going to draw 4x the current and do bad things
Thank you boB and FNG.
I was using a desk top power supply to test a diverter to give stone a reference to what his diverter #1 should be showing at his battery voltage.
FNG- thank you for answering the question in more detail. I have mainly 12v remaining and might possibly have ended up sending a 12v if I didn't find a 24v.... So that leads me to my next question... What resistor is swapped out for each battery voltage and to what resistor as well...
You can send me a message if this is not the best thing to pop ut on the forum. I do understand.
Yeah, forgot that part about the resistance difference.
I thought you might be trying to use say, a 48V Chinook on a 12V battery (without MPPT) which most likely would not work due to stalling the turbine.
The resistors are on the order of just a few Ohms. Can't remember the details. Ryan probably knows that right off the top.
Quote from: The Ugly One on October 03, 2022, 12:27:10 PM
Thank you boB and FNG.
I was using a desk top power supply to test a diverter to give stone a reference to what his diverter #1 should be showing at his battery voltage.
FNG- thank you for answering the question in more detail. I have mainly 12v remaining and might possibly have ended up sending a 12v if I didn't find a 24v.... So that leads me to my next question... What resistor is swapped out for each battery voltage and to what resistor as well...
You can send me a message if this is not the best thing to pop ut on the forum. I do understand.
It is the large green resistor and I dont know the values off my head. They may be on that schematic boB posted or I may be able to pull build info from our server
Summer is here!
How do I know?
My house bank is at 100%, and all 4 of my Midnite Solar Chinook 200 wind turbine dump loads are showing red lights and are hot to the touch.
(No wind currently)
I suspect that they are dumping current from my panels and classic 150. (Wiz bang Jr is showing 100% state of charge, and is claiming I'm charging at 18 amps)
Does anyone have a good tech article on how to do this better?
Would eventually like to use the extra power to heat hot water for hydronic heating, if that helps?
Thanks!
Edit... Sorry Stone ! Now I remember who you are and where your install is :)
Stone, would love to see a picture of that setup if you can.
These dump loads are on the battery side I am assuming ?
You might adjust the diversion so that it dumps at a bit higher voltage so that the dump happens above and beyond the solar input to the batteries. Also, adjust the solar charging so that they charge at a slightly lower voltage than the wind turbines are charging before that dump load turns on. That should allow the dumping to happen only after the battery voltage rises above the solar charging voltage which would then be the wind turbine charging.
Are you using Clipper mode in the wind Classics ? Or are you using the Chinooks with a Classic or just running into the batteries and using the Classic to dump battery voltage ?
boB
Panels --> classic 150 --> battery bank
Turbines --> dump load controllers --> common buss --> battery bank
The charge voltage settings on the classic are set to:
EQ: 32.3 volts
Absorb 29.6 volts
Float 27.0 volts
The turbine dump load controllers are set up per FNG's instruction
"That all said if you set the chinook diversion controller to Con2- SLD and Con3-OVP it will regulate at 30.2vdc so that is above your 29.6 you would need to disable the controller when you EQ of course"
Looks like sometime during the night the port side forward Chinook controller went offline or died (green light is off) so I'm pretty sure that I'm going to need a better solution.
What's the best way to do this?
I would have to look at documentation for the Chinnook controller and dump load to remember what the LEDs are for.
So, with no solar, does the battery voltage go much above 30.2 V ? If not then the dump controller is working ?
Not sure what a Con2- SLD and Con3-OVP is. Oh yeah ! That IS the Chinook controller ! Someone may chime in with another option but for the moment, I will see what I can find.
boB
... I think you may have answered this in a different thread boB.
I have 2 classic 150s.
One of them has my panels on it.
The second is a spare (purchased when I was planning on a 12v system)
... I would like to set this up to heat hot water with any excess power (hydronic heating is in the world)
Can I tie all 4 of my turbines into a classic 150, and then set it to follow my primary controller?
I have a wiz bang Jr on the primary.
I think my current issue is that my primary 150 tried to EQ my bank and the dump loads on the wind turbines tried to dissipate the power as heat.
Thoughts?
Quote from: Stone on March 26, 2023, 09:55:42 PM... I think you may have answered this in a different thread boB.
I have 2 classic 150s.
One of them has my panels on it.
The second is a spare (purchased when I was planning on a 12v system)
... I would like to set this up to heat hot water with any excess power (hydronic heating is in the world)
Can I tie all 4 of my turbines into a classic 150, and then set it to follow my primary controller?
Well, I suppose you could try that actually. But the one Classic will treat them as one turbine.
Each turbine has its own internal rectifier so you won't back-feed anything at least. AND on the boat, when one is getting wind, the others are most likely also getting wind. Are they all pretty much spinning about the same that you can tell ?
Sure, let me know how that goes !
You are running Classics in Follow-Me ? That may be why you caught one doing an EQ. Those Follow-Me cables might need to be moved away from other wires or possibly in a conductive conduit to help reduce noise. Really though, noise should not make them do that. But, I have heard that moving the cable can fix that issue, it that is what it was.
Quote from: Stone on March 26, 2023, 09:55:42 PMI have a wiz bang Jr on the primary.
I think my current issue is that my primary 150 tried to EQ my bank and the dump loads on the wind turbines tried to dissipate the power as heat.
Thoughts?
Second classic is still in the box.
Turbines voltage setting (dump load) is lower than eq settings in classic, so wen system hit that voltage, turbine controller tried to dump the entire system, solar included...
Maybe?
When the system is in Absorb, you could start raising the battery charge voltage (Absorb) and see when it starts to dump.
When you are equalizing, you will have to either raise the dump voltage or turn it off during that time I think. If you turn it off for EQ and are using wind, you will just want to be careful so the battery voltage doesn't go through the roof.
No ? Yes ? Maybe ? :)
I'm not sure how to attach pics to a post with the new forum. :/
All 4 turbines are pretty much in the same wind, so they would reasonably work together maybe?
Is there a way to make the classic trip a relay when it goes into EQ?
Could use it to disconnect the turbines from the battery bank until it comes out of EQ?
Or better, switch them to a hot water heater element while the EQ happens?
... I'm pretty sure one of my dump load controllers is dead, so I need to figure this out.
For now all the turbines are disconnected with their brakes on.
Is there a document anywhere that can guide me here?
I would use the Aux 1 output to trip when the battery voltage goes above a certain point.
That voltage would most likely be somewhere between Absorb and EQ voltage.
I think that is called diversion active high mode.
I don't think there is an Aux mode specifically activated by EQ though.
boB