Problems with new firmware 1797

[Taos]

I was at my cabin out east and all was good with the kid charge controller firmware 1742, I decided to check for new software and downloaded the new firmware 1797 and installed it , well I noticed right away it started to charge at low light levels alright!, it was late in the day just before sunset, the next morning I decided to equalize my batteries and noticed the charge controller would click and go to rest mode even when there was lots of sun shinning directly on solar panel, and battery voltage was around 13.2 volts my absorb voltage was set to 14.3 volts and float 13.9 volts, it would click on and off sometimes for 2 seconds and sometimes longer 15 seconds ,even though the battery voltages did not reach my 15.5 volts I set for equilazation, I did a reset on the charge controller and still the same problem ,I also tried shutting down the charge controller for a minute and then power in it up ,same thing , since I  didn't have the old firmware on my laptop with me at the Cabin  I couldn't reload the old firmware 1742 , once I got home I reloaded the old 1742 firmware ,I didn't get a chance to try it yet. Anybody else have this problem?

[Vic]

Hi Taos,

Have not run the latest KID CC Firmware,  so cannot speak to any differences twix that version and the prior ...

And some additional info on the system of the KID is part,  would be helpful.

It sounds like there is a single PV on the KID system (?).

However,  generally one would want to only EQ after the battery is essentially fully-charged.

It is possible that there is just too little PV power available to get very close to the set EQ voltage,  although do not know why the KID would Rest,  instead of just perhaps be in EQ MPPT.

So,  what are the details of this system -- amount of PV,  String Vmp,  battery Capacity,  voltage,  orientation of the PV array,  ambient temps,  outside,  and inside,  the approximate location of this cabin ...   etc.

This post has been just sitting there,  and wanted to get some discussion going.
Thanks!   Vic

[boomadge]

I used from 1742 to 1797 as we'll, also had to input all settings back in as they where lost during update. I have not had any issue with equalizing but I also have 24 volt setup.

[Taos]

Here is a update with more info , first of all most of the components are of my learning and are used for this cabin on the east coast in p.e.i.  ,all but the kid charge controller that I use at the cabin and bring it home and use it for my r.v . And charging other batteries around the house tractors and cars that I use very rarely( so battery maintenance) ok I have 4 15 watt solar panels ( mounted to the cabin facing south ,hooked up in parallel these panels are cheap coleman panels I don't have the specs on them as I'm back home, I know there for  12 volt charging I think the voc is around 18 volts, ok so these panels are hooked up to a coleman cheap charge controller, and the batteries are 3 marine ,rv batteries ,model srm-24 550 cca,690 marine cold ,cranking amps.( I know there not deep cycle batteries and are not very good that's why there at the cabin, ok I also have a sun force 130 watt panel( vmp 17.1 volts ,imp 7.6 amps,voc 24 volts,hooked up to the kid charge controller,and hooked up to the same 3 interstate batteries, the 130 watt panel is not mounted , I mouve it to proper angle and in the direction of the sun for maximum output, the temperature was around 65 f or 17 Celsius, the batteries were fully charged as there voltage was 13 volts , so what was happening was the kid charge controller would go to resting and cycle from charging bulk to resting sometimes 1 second and vary 2 seconds ,10 seconds ,4 seconds, 2 seconds ,7 seconds ,etc,  it wouldn't stay in bulk charge , the voltage would never reach the preset 14.3 volt absorb  or even the 13.9 float voltage , when charging the kid would read 95 watts then drop to resting, so I tried equalizing the batteries and the same thing would happen , I tried resetting the kid several times and the same would happen , I even tried powering down the kid and no diference, the kid worked perfectly the day before with the old firmware 1742,  once I got home I reinstalled the old firmware 1742 and I charged a battery today using a sun force 130 watt panel as I have one at the cabin and one at the house  all worked perfectly,  I will be returning to the cabin later in the summer and I will bring both firmware versions on a memory stick also second 130 watt solar panel from home so I can try them both , back to back on the same solar array system .
Thanks Don ( Taos)

[ClassicCrazy]

My guess is that the Sunforce panel is not providing a high enough voltage to charge the batteries - or the batteries are old  and mismatched and if they are not deep cycle type may be swinging in voltage too much as they charge which messes up the Kid logic.
Batteries can do some weird things with voltage if they are bad  like show a good voltage but under load take a big dive. Could be it also swings with charging. And if they are not deep cycle batteries they don't last long when used deep cycle. They are made to take a lot of amps out very quickly for a brief time ( to supply starter motor) but then get replenished fast from alternator . Deep cycling ruins them. It is usually recommended that all batteries be the same type and age because as they age they change characteristics.

Try doing a load test on each battery using a good sized DC load and monitor the voltage as you do that using a digital multimeter .

You could also experiment with limiting the charge current setting in the Kid - lower it down to a few amps to see if it charges okay and then increase it up to see if it that causes it - just a way to check if your solar panel is able to provide the current and voltage it needs to. I believe the MPPT logic needs to see a high enough differential between what the panel is supplying and the battery voltage .

There are some other solar charging modes in the Kid that  I haven't used - Solar 2 and Legacy - you might read up on those to see if they may help with your problem since they may eliminate the MPPT voltage sweep .
.

Larry

[Taos]

You might be right on the batteries as I know one is older then the other , and the new firmware 1797might be more sensitive to minor voltage differences , like I said earlier all my old equipement is brought to the cabin , I know there not deep cycle batteries even though that's what's written on them ( they came on my new travel trailer and I  removed them and replaced them in my trailer with sunextender agm batterries , I did test  the batterries at the cabin and and two passed the test and one passed ( borderline ,  there not used for heavy loads ,just ( cfl )light bulbs, and cell phone charging, etc, and not discharged less then 25% or less,  they are on charge all year ( with the cheap coleman permanent mounted 4x15 watt solar panels and cheap coleman charge controller)but I go up in the spring and do a equilize charge on them and then go later in summer and do the same, to try and make them last as long as I can, all I know is the old firmware 1742 works perfectly with the system  as it is  ,i used the system with the old firmware for 5 days and all was good ,the problem popped up after upgrading to the new firmware 1797, the only thing I noticed was low light charging was improved with the new firmware,with the old 1742 firmware the kid would under low light conditions constantly click on and off.
Thanks for all your Input
Don

[Westbranch]

Do you have any numbers as to the exact SoC in the morning before charging starts. Are they consistent ie within a few % every day?
How fast does the SoC drop?

If you are not depleting enough you will not get a 'seemingly full' recharge, as the CC can/will do a short Bulk/ Absorb since it thinks the battery does not need it...  I see this on my standby (for now ) battery vs the (house) used one...  the standby one is done in a matter of 1 hr after sun  hits the panels... 
I'm currently fine tuning my Classic to the battery bank and not really familiar with the Kid yet, so this is from a Classic view,  Does the KID allow fine tuning of the battery parameters like the Classic?

And,  what ClassicCrazy said is also true, different batteries, different charge rates/ life style, etc ...

hth
hth

[Taos]

As I was only there for 7days  and there was no wizbang junior to monitor the amp hours,all I can go on was the battery volts each morning was around 12.5-12.6 v each morning for the first 5 days this was just around sunrise, then once I made breakfast using some power lights,radio ,and one heavier load electric toaster one cycle around 1200watts at 120volts=10 amps or 100 amps at 12 volts , this is aprox for one minute ( I never timed it) then no large loads maybe a light (cfl) 23 watts at 120 volts   on and off ,for the next 1/2 hour and then all loads off just the inverter standby draw ( it's a cheap 1500watt inverter modify sine wave no sure on brand or standby draw)then  I went for a bike ride for a couple of hours and came back to check batteries to see if they were fully charged thats when I noticed the kid cycling on and off and the voltage was around 13. 2 v and the kids indicator LEDs didn't show that it went to float and the cheap coleman charge controller was in bulk mode,but the kid was cycling on and off going to resting mode  with the 130 watt sunforce panel pointing directly at the sun producing according to the kid around 90 watts,on and off as it wouldnt stay in bulk mode  it kept going into resting mode  so most of the charging was coming from the cheap coleman charge controller with its 60 watts of solar panels , I'm not sure how much power they were making I would think somewhere around 40 watts as they are fixed and the sun was not at optimum angle on them,,I thought this was odd, so I tried resetting the kid and also tried powering down the kid and it did the same as before,(cycling)so later that day when the cheap charge controller went to float I tried equalizing the batteries using the kid and it would do the same cycle on and off and go to resting with full sun and panels facing the sun.and voltage would never reach more then 14.5,since it was my last day there( at the cabin) I disconnected the kid charge controller and packed it up to bring back home as I use it at home for maintenance of batteries and for my travel trailer, once home I reinstalled the old firmware 1742 and charged a battery and all was good. But like I said in earlier post never went back to try it at the cabin.but I will later in the summer.( with both firmware on a memory stick ) oh almost forgot I even tried changing ( clicking setting from default 8 up and down it made a difference not sure how many seconds it would delay or speed up the clicking cycle but was something like 15 seconds or so I didn't time them but still would go to resting mode to bulk and back and forth.
Don